Anyone ever hone their cylinders with a flex hone tool?

http://www.flexhone.com/flexhone%20for%20cylinders.htm (http://www.flexhone.com/flexhone%20for%20cylinders.htm)

I have a 327 that will get rebuilt and I'm curious what grit to use. They come in 120, 180, 240, and 320. Should you always finish with the highest grit? Or is there a better choice for a 327?

Thanks

Stone grit is to match the rings used. Cast iron can get by with a 180 grit but a hard chromed ring will require finishing with a 320. The ring manufacturer has a finishing procedure in the installation instructions. You realize that a deglazer or ball hone will not yield a truly round cylinder for perfect ring seal on start-up?

Everyone used to use either a deglazer or a Sunen micrometer head hone on a 1/2 inch drill to finish their bores in the good old days before block plates. In those days we used to break in cars because the rings wouldn't seat for several hundreds of miles because the bores were so out of round.

Big Dave

So would my best bet be to have a machine shop do the honing? I opened up the motor today and I can see some cross-hatch towards the bottom of the cylinder, but it's pretty shiny from the middle on up. The pistons look pretty clean, as did everything else inside.

If you are planning on only installing rings and bearings I would deglaze it with a ball hone. Rings that you choose determines the grit to use. Have you bought the rings yet? If not the stock cast iron will provide the best seal in the shortest period of time for a stock build.

Big Dave

By stock cast iron, do you mean rings? I haven't bought any rings (or anything at all) yet. I wanna have a game plan before going out and buying anything. When we bought the car the engine started, but it couldn't be driven since the brake shoes were removed from the drums. The previous owner had it for many years with the intentions of restoring it and dismantled the brake system so that the wheels would never seize up. Long story short, he never did anything with it and he also allowed someone to come over and cut the exhaust system off for their own car. Needless to say that to let it run for any period of time it was quite loud and disturbed the neighbors. We stored it for four years after purchasing it, during which time the float in the carb got stock and the fuel pump disentegrated. I put in a new fuel pump, got the engine to start, and the carb dumped fuel all over the place and flooded the motor. It ran long enough for me to feel comfortable knowing that it indeed would start and wasn't seized.

Here's what I'd like to do:

Re-paint the block
Re-build the bottom end (rings, bearings, seals)
I'm looking at staying with the flat tappet cam and lifters (cost effective)
Summit top end kit containing edelbrock heads, intake, cam, lifters, and 600 cfm carb etc.
March Performance Serpentine belt conversion kit

I'm still learning, what do you think about this setup?

I am more experienced with the world of 1.6 - 2.2L DOHC honda motors and stuff like that.:o

Only fly in the ointment is the flat tappet cam. Motor oil is no longer made for flat tappets since the last Chevy to have them was made in 1985. You will have to remove each lifter and keep them in exact order as each tappet must go back on the same exact lobe it came off of. It has worn in to that lobe and any change will aggravate the lack of metals in the motor oils you will face with this cam. The only motor oil you can now buy is for racing only (off road use only) marked "illegal to use on any emission controlled car". This is because there is no DZZP in the motor oil anymore, now that everything is built with roller cam followers.

And yes I refer to the material the rings are made of being solid cast iron. Other choices are moly filled and chrome.

Big Dave

Ok, this is going to be an issue, cause I turned the motor on the engine stand to get at the spark plugs better and four lifters fell out. I was planning to replace the cam anyway by using a kit that came with cam and lifters. For example:

http://store.summitracing.com/partdetail.asp?part=SUM-CEDL402

Can I do this? More importantly can I do this with today's off the shelf motor oil? I am not in an emissions controlled area, so I don't know if I'd need to worry about that.

I really appreciate all your help!

I have heard Royal Purple is the way to go.

http://www.synerlec.com/

Doesn't mater which brand of racing oil you buy, (Valvoline, Penzoil, Castrol, Shell or Mobil) so long as it has DZZP in the can you can run a flat tappeT.

You are correct. If you change the cam you must buy new lifters as well as they all wear in together.

Big Dave

thank you!

So here's an off the wall question...My engine has flat tappet cams and lifters in it from stock. If my car was in pristine condition and I was driving it somewhat regularly, what would I have to do to do an oil change? Let's forget about the fact that I now know DZZP is important for a flat tappet engine. Hypothetically speaking, let's say I needed an oil change and took my impala to the local jiffy lube for an oil change. What would happen if they changed my oil and didn't put in oil with DZZP?

I guess this would explain why people are using roller cams and the appropriate lifters now? I could always retrofit my block for this, but it'll cost a bit more money...I'm just suprised that if DZZP is so important for flat tappet applications that manufacturers are still making these parts.

So here's an off the wall question...My engine has flat tappet cams and lifters in it from stock. If my car was in pristine condition and I was driving it somewhat regularly, what would I have to do to do an oil change? Let's forget about the fact that I now know DZZP is important for a flat tappet engine. Hypothetically speaking, let's say I needed an oil change and took my impala to the local jiffy lube for an oil change. What would happen if they changed my oil and didn't put in oil with DZZP?

I guess this would explain why people are using roller cams and the appropriate lifters now? I could always retrofit my block for this, but it'll cost a bit more money...I'm just suprised that if DZZP is so important for flat tappet applications that manufacturers are still making these parts.

They make those parts because customers see the higher price for the better product and demand a cheaper alternative (but if you collect old catalogs like I do you note that the number of pages of flat tappet cams is now down to only a page or two and the rest of the catalog is rollers). Manufactures still sell lots and lots of guns, when all they do is kill things. Why? Because people still want them. So long as there is a demand for a product it will be sold.

If you went into Jiffy lube and asked for the special of the day you would drive out of there happy, and in only fifteen minutes you would have destroyed the engine.

It will not die in their parking lot, nor on your next nightly cruise. What you have done is accelerated (Warp factor 7 Mr. Crusher) the rate of wear between the lifter tappet and the face of the cam lobe. All of those iron filings are now floating around in your engines oil and being embedded in the soft lead babbit of your engine's bearings. They work their way into the timing chain and accelerate the rate of wear there as well, which also gets pumped through the gears of the oil pump and wears it out. Every part that should have lasted at least a hundred thousand miles will now wear out in a few thousands of miles (about the time for you next oil change).

Flat tappets are gone. They were left behind in 1985 when GM changed over. You are just now catching up with the rest of the world, and only because in 2004 the oil companies forced you into this predicament.

Big Dave

Thank you! Good to know, it looks like roller cams and lifters are going to be worth the extra money. I appreciate how clearly you present your information!

Hey Kiddo, I really appreciate your "thinking" on our 327. However, its been my experience that sometimes some of the work should be left to those who "know". How bad would it be to have a pro do the engine work that we aren't up on?