Vibration Issues - Impala Tech
Transmission & Driveline Transmissions & Differentials

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  • 1 Post By Big Dave
 
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post #1 of 10 (permalink) Old 09-11-2020, 10:06 PM Thread Starter
 
 
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Vibration Issues

I had 5.3 Vortec engine and 4l60e transmission installed in my 63 Impala. Drive shaft was modified as result of going from 700R4 to the 4l60E. Carrier bearing was replaced and driveshaft was balanced. No problem initially but started getting bad vibrations mid car at about 60mph +. Had ball joints, control arm bushings, tire rod ends and shocks replaced after finding wear in these components. After this had front end alignment done. While car rides better, I still have the vibration. Any thoughts on what could be causing this?
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post #2 of 10 (permalink) Old 09-11-2020, 11:16 PM
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How old is the carrier bearing? They do seem to wear out fast.

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post #3 of 10 (permalink) Old 09-12-2020, 01:28 PM
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Drive line work requires balancing your propeller shaft(s) and keeping them in phase. A Constant velocity joint substituted for the back half mid mount universal joint really helps smooth out the harmonics. Just look at how Cadillac and Buick solved the vibration problem with constant velocity joints in their X-frame cars.

1963 to 1967 drive shaft

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post #4 of 10 (permalink) Old 09-12-2020, 09:21 PM Thread Starter
 
 
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Carrier bearing is only four months old
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post #5 of 10 (permalink) Old 09-12-2020, 09:42 PM Thread Starter
 
 
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Thanks for your quick response Dave. Is it possible to purchase a constant velocity joint online for a 63 Impala. If so could you make a recommendation? If not; would it require purchasing one for a different year / model car that would work?
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post #6 of 10 (permalink) Old 09-13-2020, 10:49 AM
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First thing I would suspect is the hangar bearing. Second would be incorrect driveline angles due to the engine/trans swap. What engine mounts and trans crossmember did you use? Have you measured the angles?

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post #7 of 10 (permalink) Old 09-14-2020, 11:32 AM Thread Starter
 
 
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I will be checking the angles and the hangar bearing this week. Will need to check on the question about the engine mounts and crossmember as installation was done by someone else. Thanks for your reply and suggestions.
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post #8 of 10 (permalink) Old 09-14-2020, 02:02 PM
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Causes of a drive line vibration:

1.) Out of balance due to poor machine work (getting it shortened) or installing Universal Joints out of phase (kills factory balance).

2.) Drive line angle: must be opposite but equal to prevent harmonics from universal joints accelerating and decelerating as they flex. Google Drive Line Angle for reams of info on this topic.

3.) Too steep of an angle to allow the universal to work (think mile high 4x4, but it also applies if you drop your bagged car to the ground equally as well).

A constant velocity joint fixes all of these issues by being two universals caged together to increase drive angle and cancel acceleration/deceleration from turning. They are used on expensive cars for this reason. Unfortunately the Chevy was GM's "entry level" car (aka the cheapest piece of junk GM made).

So even though a Caddy was made in the same plant and shared sheet metal with the Impala all of the good parts never made it onto the Chevy. But because GM only made one part to fit every car (official doctrine passed into canon at the NOV 1957 executive board meeting). Caddy parts interchange with Buick, Olds, Pontiac and Chevy parts. They interchange not to make Hollander rich but to save GM money on taxes owed the IRS on inventory. The only thing that made a Caddy or Olds different from the Chevy or Buick was the motor. Prior to 1973 every marque had it's own unique motor, that had their own driving characteristics.

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post #9 of 10 (permalink) Old 09-17-2020, 09:56 AM
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I've heard some people have lots of issues with new center carrier bearings. You would think new would be great, but unfortunately these are now being made in China by an employee that is overworked and under paid.

Performance driveline makes complete drive shafts and they make them to go in Higher HP cars. Stock drive shafts are only good for a little over 400 HP. They make an HD drive shaft that is good for up to 800 HP. After 800 HP you need to start looking into a 1 piece drive shaft modification. I'm not sure why they list HP as the limiting factor considering I would think torque would be what destroys a drive shaft?

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post #10 of 10 (permalink) Old 09-17-2020, 01:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Deadwolf View Post
I've heard some people have lots of issues with new center carrier bearings. You would think new would be great, but unfortunately these are now being made in China by an employee that is overworked and under paid.

Performance driveline makes complete drive shafts and they make them to go in Higher HP cars. Stock drive shafts are only good for a little over 400 HP. They make an HD drive shaft that is good for up to 800 HP. After 800 HP you need to start looking into a 1 piece drive shaft modification. I'm not sure why they list HP as the limiting factor considering I would think torque would be what destroys a drive shaft?

Most of the junk carrier bearings are actually made in India and Pakistan. There was only one company making a reliable carrier bearing but it was mounted in yellow polyurethane instead of rubber that scared off most people.

And yes you are correct it is torque that breaks parts not horsepower (just consider a Toyota making 400 hp compared to a 400 horse 396 big block Chevy engine. Technically by spinning to 11,000 RPM you can make 400 horse with a 1.6 liter normally aspirated engine, but it isn't going to break anything in an American V8 drive line).

We have NASCAR to blame for American's associating horsepower with tire shredding power because NASCAR painted the rated horsepower on the hood of the car in two foot tall letters. They never mentioned torque because torque accelerates a car to speed, and horsepower is what pushed the air out of the way and over came friction to run around in circles on a high banked oval track. (horsepower also determines top end speed at the salt flats with a five to nine mile acceleration ahead of the measured mile, so once again torque is never mentioned. If you want to drag race then that is all you are concerned with is torque (actually you are really concerned with setting up your suspension and getting large enough tires to hold the torque your motor makes to accelerate your car).

The 6.5 liter baby big block is a different story than the situation with the Toyota four banger. The high reving short stroke 409 broke rear ends and Bog-Warner T-10 transmissions under warranty all the time. This is why when Chevy introduced the high torque long stroke 396 in 1965 they also replaced the T-10 with a super sized version called a Muncie and gave up entirely on their own rear end instead buying a stronger 12 bolt rear end from Dana-Spicer Spicer made the 10 and 12 bolt and the Corvette got the Dana 44 in it's IRS rear end). Broken cars in the dealership service bay cost GM money to fix and reduced brand loyalty associated with a car that breaks down every time you side step the clutch at eight grand.

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