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1962 Coupe 327 ressurection - Pawpaw's ride

20K views 111 replies 15 participants last post by  cintocrunch 
#1 · (Edited)
I just joined the site to hopefully document and learn some things. Sorry if this is long winded, but I want to share the complete story of the car.

My Great Uncle bought this car new, had it a year and then sold it to my Grandfather (Pawpaw). It was used as the family car and also driven by my Dad and my uncle. They say they gave the car hell, and I believe it. It was put in the garage sometime around 1980 due to a bad fuel pump.

Now, the good part. My Pawpaw doesn't like to get rid of things and the car sat covered in his garage, moved once in the late 1990's, and finally mid 2015, we decided it was time to get it back on the road.

We found out 3 months ago that he was diagnosed with colon cancer and will be starting chemo next week. He is 84 years old and has never had any sort of health problems.

We started out by replacing fuel pump, plugs, wires, water pump, hoses, belts, etc.

We also replaced all brake lines with stainless, wheel cylinders, master cylinder, and rubber hoses.

Replaced the power steering ram and hoses

We eventually got the motor to run, but it was obvious that we had some issues. Cylinders 4&8 were not firing. That's when we decided to go ahead and pull the motor and have it rebuilt.

Here is the car moved out of the garage under its own power before the motor was pulled.

This car is in amazing shape! No rust other than some very minor surface rust on the rear bumper and body.



327 and Aluminum Powerglide being removed


Pawpaw, Uncle Brian, Dad


Uncle Brian, Pawpaw, and Me



Motor is out
 
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#3 · (Edited)
This is a matching #'s car and has never had anything done to the motor or transmission. We are having the motor rebuilt with a mild cam. I dropped the motor off yesterday. I am taking the transmission today to have it rebuilt. Our goal is to get it driveable as soon as possible, considering my Pawpaw's health. We want him to be able to drive it this summer to our family reuinion.
 
#10 ·
This is a matching #'s car and has never had anything done to the motor or transmission. We are having the motor rebuilt with a mild cam. I dropped the motor off yesterday. I am taking the transmission to day to have it rebuilt. Our goal is to get it driveable as soon as possible, considering my Pawpaw's health. We want him to be able to drive it this summer to our family reuinion.
Replace the cam and lifters (do both) if you need to. 'Upgrading' the the cam to increase power may not do much unless you also address the carb, intake, heads, and exhaust. If you did all that, then the PowerGlide is going to 'bog' you down.

Personally, if you intend to keep the car 'original', I'd rebuild the engine to OEM specs as much as possible.

Enjoy!
 
#6 ·
Just heard back from the motor builder. He has the motor torn apart. A couple of the studs had pulled out of the heads, causing some minor damage. Obviously the cylinder walls are in bad shape. Overall the motor was in really good condition. I will walk over after lunch and snap some pics. The nice part about him being less than 100 yds from our office:D

I dropped the trans off about an 30 mins ago and they will be starting on it this week.

Here are a few more pics of the car



Rear axle








 
#8 ·
Welcome, Wes! Awesome car and I'll keep your Pawpaw in our prayers! Good luck and thanks for the pictures.
 
#11 · (Edited)
Denis- thank you for that. My Pawpaw is the greatest man that I have ever known!

Pete- we will be replacing all of the fuel system in the car, no telling what the inside of the tank looks like. As far as the motor rebuild, it will be getting a mild cam and we will be putting long tube ceramic coated headers on it, along with a higher stall converter. Crank is in good shape and will get polished. Carb will be rebuilt (4 barrel Rochester). The car will kept mostly original for now. Not sure what will happen in the future as far as suspension, wheels, A/c, steering, etc. Interior will be reupholstered to original colors.

I will post updates on everything along with pictures as we get everything back in the car. We still need clean up the engine bay/firewall, remove and clean the trans crossmember, and replace body mounts.

Any idea on the best place to get bodymounts? should we put in poly body/motor/trans mounts or go back with rubber mounts?

Here is a video of it running after sitting for 36 years
https://youtu.be/B5X9pYGbgdc
 
#13 ·
Wonderful survivor, just like your Dad.

I always use rubber body and engine/trans mounts. The urethane can be a bit jarring. I use urethane suspension bushings for handling.

The headers on these cars can be a pain. I have Hedman's on my '62 and needed to "tweak" them to fit better. I always buy raw headers and have them ceramic coated AFTER I fit them to the car. The shorty's may actually be a better choice and let the exhaust shop fab the connecting pipe.

I hope you don't have plans to paint the car. They are only original survivors once and that paint looks very good yet with some "character" added.
 
#14 ·
Thanks everyone for the kind words and prayers for my Grandfather. He WILL drive this car again, and very soon I hope.

Here are a couple of more pics of the torn down motor. It is being sent to the machine shop today to have the heads and block checked/worked.

block




block numbers
Flint July2
S= 1962 327 Powerglide
 
#16 ·
If the machine shop wants to deck the block, have them program the machine to STOP before it removes that stamp. They can do it if they want to. That stamp is worth a LOT of value to the car.
 
#17 ·
The machine shop knows to keep all numbers.

Question- How would one know what motor originally came in the car? We know for a fact that this is the original motor, but I'm curious how one would find out if you didn't know. For instance, how would you know if the original motor was a 250hp or 300hp 327?

We are also thinking about putting a set of double hump heads on it. The machine shop has a set that he is willing to sell. We would obviously keep the original heads, just so we had the originals. Not really worried about ever having to sell the car. The plan is to keep it in the family
 
#19 ·
One can get a lot of hp out of a 327 but to do so requires 'upping' the power band to the high rpm range. You will have power at the flywheel but the power glide and your likely high ratio rear won't transmit that power to the rear wheels well. What your drive train will like is more low end torque. For street driving, more displacement (383 stroker built for low end torque) will make the car much more pleasant (and quicker) than a high revving 327.

Here's a link to some info:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qe9ke0rQlT8

Notice the difference (or lack of significant difference) in the dyno numbers between the headers and manifolds.

Today's heads flow much better than the old double humpers. Cost wise the double humpers are a poor choice unless 'originality' is important to you.

Not being critical, just trying to be helpful. :beers:
 
#20 ·
I vote with either keeping your original heads or going with the double-hump heads. You will have to sink money into either set. The reason being is they have the correct "look" with NO accessory bolt holes at the end of the heads. Any heads newer than 1968 WILL have accessory bolt holes at the end of the heads. And IMO, this ruins the correct look of the 1962 327 engine.
Yes, the newer head MAY give you a few more horsepower, but who cares? You aren't racing the car, correct?
Please post the casting number from the double-hump heads. The last 3 numbers should be "461" or "462".
I just had a set completely rebuilt including new valves, valve seats, bowl cleanup and port matching to the intake manifold. I know I spent more money on my heads than I would have buying new heads, but I did not care --> my 327 runs AND looks GREAT!
 

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#22 ·
Here is my advice: Do you homework on the cam. Call cam companies and talk to your engine builder. And don't buy a cam for the idle. Buy one that fits your combination. Roller cams are a good upgrade, but you can still run flat-tappets with the right oil, which is not hard to find. And I'm sure the car won't be driven daily, so an oil change with special oil every 1-1.5 years won't break the bank. FWIW, i used this cam: CompCams XE256H-10.
Exhaust: I recommend 2½" ram horn exhaust manifolds.
 
#23 · (Edited)
Dennis is offering very good advise.

The 327 was replaced by the 350 in 1968 in full size cars because the days of screaming down the strip with 4.11 gears had long passed. People wanted a larger motor to move a larger car. This is why the 350 was augmented with the introduction of the 400 cubic inch small block Chevy in 1970.

If you could find one (they were sucked up and used up by racers over the decades so they are rare today) the SBC 400 is a perfect motor for your grand father's car. It offers lots of torque to move the car but is as docile as your 327 as far as being a pleasure to drive on the street. It didn't make much in terms of horsepower in stock trim as it was designed to be a smog era motor that runs on lead free gas (something your 327 isn't capable of doing without retarding your ignition costing you power). But with a head and cam swap and the addition of a four barrel (they were all two barrel from the factory) it can easily make 400 to 500 horsepower.

If you are not going to increase the displacement to obtain more torque (say by dropping a SBC's 400 crank into your 327 to turn it into a 383) you are going to have to spin it higher in RPM to enjoy the power potential. In the sixties they made ten grand tachometers because the 283 was bouncing off the 10K tach's peg when raced. The 327 could also spin that high but it's quarter inch longer stroke wasn't as happy at that RPM and often came apart (I scattered a few myself). The 350 added another quarter inch of stroke and the 400 added a half inch longer stroke to the 327's crank throw added to a much larger bore (the difference between the 4.030 inch bore 383 and the 4.125 bore of the 400).

Comp Cams sells a hydraulic flat tappet cams that mimics the exhaust note sound of all of Chevy's hot cams sold over the service counter. You can buy a 302 Z/28 cam that used the old Duntov 30/30 solid cam originally, or an LT-1 370 horse 350 Corvette solid lifter cam, or the hydraulic lifter L-79 350 horse 327 cam from the Chevelle and Chevy II. All three of these hydraulic flat tappet Comp Cams use more modern cam lobe designs to offer more lift with less duration than the originals did. Their lopey idle sounds the same as the original service cams because they add the duration on the exhaust side only; so that there isn't as adverse an effect on the engines vacuum.

Lunati and Crane sell similar cams with retro fit hydraulic rollers that offer even more power potential as a roller lobe has a lot more area under the curve than a flat tappet because they can use a more aggressive ramp to accelerate the valve open than you can accomplish with a flat tappet using a Chevy diameter lifter.

Heads make the power in a motor. Heads have become computer designed to improve power (actually they were designed to reduce emissions but a more complete combustion also makes more power). In the early sixties the heads and intakes were designed to lower production costs by making it easier to cast as the highest priority and horse power an after thought. Even the fuelie heads (Camel hump) are just a larger port volume made in the image of the standard head with bigger valves.

The Fuelie head can not compare to the Vortec head used on a 1996-2004 Chevy pick-up. The Vortec head flows more and burns the gas better due to an improved heart shaped combustion chamber that Chevy spent a million and a half dollars over six years developing. The aftermarket took the final design criteria developed by GM's engineers and cast it in aluminum to keep from being sued by GM.

When painted orange with the front bolt holes in the head filled with a bolt that has been ground off it can pass for a stock head. Some people go so far as to take a pair of AFR 190 heads and having the end milled to look like a fuelie head.



Big Dave
 
#24 ·
Great story and a great car. Really cool to see the pictures of y'all and PawPaw getting that engine out of there.
that body looks straight enough that I vote for not painting it either! The patina and character marks are great! That's history right there.
 
#25 ·
I agree with Big Dave.

Here's a link to just about all the info one might need to consider when building a sbc (substitute 'car' for 'truck' for your situation):

http://www.chevytalk.org/fusionbb/showtopic.php?tid/333022/post/new/#NEW

You may not be interested and it is a lot of reading. However, it is VERY educational and hopefully helpful. If your are interested, taking the time to read it all will be of benefit. Putting parts together in search of more hp often does not yield the desired driving results.

I'm not pushing the 383 option because if it were my car I would likely just keep it original and rebuild the 327 to OEM spec. But, if the goal is to upgrade the engine, the 383 is one very good alternative.
 
#26 ·
Wow! A lot of good info and I thank everyone for that.:thumbsup: We are definetly keeping the 327 since it was the original motor. I will talk to the engine builder and see what his plans are for the cam. I by no means, have enough knowledge about motors to make that decision. (I know enough to be dangerous) Thanks to some suggestions here, I will ask him to make sure we are getting what we want. Thanks to everyone that has provided info.

On a side note that I forgot to mention. With my Pawpaw being the way he is, he bought a 327 block back some many years ago. He had a good friend work at GM and they were selling blocks at a discount. I found this jewel sitting in his garage next to the car. Still in the original crate and wrapped in plastic. It does have some minor surface rust, but the pistons all move with ease. Not sure what a brand new 327 block is worth, but I'm pretty sure that they can no longer be purchased. Any ideas on worth? I guess its only worth as much as someone is willing to pay.:D The original block got the OK from the machine shop, so we will be keeping the original in the car.













 
#29 ·
To some one with a Chevelle or an Impala that would be a good fitted block to buy for a restoration. Value will depend upon the date code of the casting. If some one were restoring one that had a build date ten days after the casting date he would be willing to pay more. The CE denotes that as a Service Block used for warranty repair or sale over the counter.

The pistons are the cast 10.25:1 used back in the sixties when gas octane was a lot higher than it is now. They where used in the 250-275-300 horse 327 motors. It is a small journal crank block and has a fitting for an oil canister instead of a spin on oil filter so it is a pre 1968 motor.

Big Dave
 
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